This is the main V-Flyer Forum for general discussion of everything related to flying with Virgin-branded travel companies.
#69920 by Vslf
19 Jul 2005, 15:17
Remember the days when VS was the innovator? When BA had to react, buck its ideas up and improve its service....ah halcyon days.

Clubhouses,Premium Economy, Freedom menu, Flat beds etc etc

Now what do we have? BA raises its fuel surcharges, snap! so do VS
BA introduces a compulsory sleeper service, snap! so do VS.

Those VS inspired innovations resulted in airlines spending money and upping their game. The new changes are cost squeezing.


I know there's a different market now (post september 11th etc), but this seems so short-sighted, spend millions on the suite roll-out and then scrimp and save a few quid here and a few quid there.

Vslf
#69921 by mcmbenjamin
19 Jul 2005, 15:43
Well I just want Diet Coke not Virgin Cola.

My request is simple.

So I bting my own.

Could we bring por own food and ask that it me served?


Koz Koz
#69923 by jaguarpig
19 Jul 2005, 15:52
BA's sleeper service has never been popular,it is even worse than what VS propose as there is no inflight meal at all but as said above is only on the short mid-east and east coast flights.There is always the option of first on BA that has full meal service on all flights.
#69926 by Richard28
19 Jul 2005, 16:14
Originally posted by Vslf
Remember the days when VS was the innovator? When BA had to react, buck its ideas up and improve its service....ah halcyon days.


I think those days ended when SRB took a back seat in managing the company.

I'm not convinced the current management have the marketing flare or customer focus that there used to be - it seems VS is slowly turning into just another business...

VS must remember that old saying "the customer is always right", and rekindle the spirit of constantly improving the customer experience.
#69929 by David_Doyle
19 Jul 2005, 16:19
Waited a while before deciding to throw my two pennies in.....

I, like many other people I think, were extremely disheartened to read of these changes. I've bought my parents Upper tickets to Barbados for January next year and though I appreciate they are not affected, if they had been on flights that were affected by this change I would be very unhappy - I chose Virgin for them as I've had good experiences and wanted to give them a great flight experience. Imagine how I would feel, having 'bigged up' Virgin and the Upper Class service for so long only to hear that they had experienced the 'new' service? And my parents would be baffled by the choices also.... all the 'You can have this but then you don't get this' would seriously undermine their opinions of the product. I can hear it now.... "Blah Blah went by BA and they didn't have to choose from all these silly complicated options AND they got a hot breakfast."[V]

1.Turndown - For customers who wish to sleep straight away, a sleep including drink and snack.
2.Express Cold Supper Tray - For customers who wish to eat fast, then sleep, a tray of cold dishes delivered all at once before having bed turned down.
3.Hot Supper Tray - For customers who will still want a full hot meal and then sleep, a tray of hot dishes inc starter delivered all at once before having bed turned down.


Surely options (1) and (2) are near identical to Snooze zone already? And if the Snooze zone concept is so popular then surely a change in the number of seats designated in the zone or some other flexibility is called for - the wholesale change in policy and enforced darkness / sleep inducement for all is just unfair. And if I've had a big night out in New York I'm not normally in the mood to go to bed at 8.00pm the following night....

The lack of choice in this matter is worrying - Richard's comments about the South African flights are spot on, as I've done these flights before. I'm not going to spend 100,000 miles on a reward flight to SA ( or money, for that matter ) if I'm going to get substantially less service than on another destination that flies during the day.

This seems to be about putting business passengers firmly before leisure passengers - I did wonder actually whether the expansion to the Clubhouse was tied into these changes : Give the passenger good service before and after and cut the service in the air? The timing coincides nicely with the improvements at LHR being opened.

David.
#69931 by Wolves27
19 Jul 2005, 16:25
I think thats what they call a good day to bury bad news.

Dean
#69932 by newby
19 Jul 2005, 16:40
Originally posted by Wolves27
I think thats what they call a good day to bury bad news.

Dean


Hopefully it wont get to the stage of it being bad news - during the course of the day i have spoken to 4 different people at the Premier Call centre as well as one person from Richard Branson's office - they all said they are pretty surprised by the info they have heard - they have limited information (apart from a very short bulletin which basically covers what is on the VA website) and 2 of them said that they are passing more than a few complaints back to Customer Support on this area. All of them felt that it would be unacceptable to offer this level of service to all UCS and they would have thought it should only be availble to those that request restricted service much like the snooze zone operates now.

They all told me to keep watching the VA website and to call back nearer the 4th August for further info.....

Personally if it does materialise as suggested I will be seriously miffed [:(!]
#69934 by fozzyo
19 Jul 2005, 16:47
They all told me to keep watching the VA website and to call back nearer the 4th August for further info.


I think that is what has really shocked me about this whole situation - no-one knows what's going on. How can they announce the launch of a new service and yet not be able to tell you very much about it, particularly only two weeks before it launches? Surely somebody somewhere in VS actually knows what is happening.

Also if this is to be a restricted to an area of the cabin its going to cause chaos at checkin for all those people who have already chosen suites. A lot will have to be juggled about to try and get people sitting in the zone they want to be in.

Foz xx
#69935 by newby
19 Jul 2005, 16:57
This just gets more bizarre - I have just had an unsolicited call back from a supervisor at the premier team apologising for the lack of information on this service. She then went on to say that the she has been told that most people have been hearing about this from an "un-official" VA website called V-Flyer (!!!) which they DO monitor and have been reading to find out more about the service! They are pretty much in the dark about it and are trying to find out more but she told me not to believe everything I read- LOL!!

Think I will just wait this one out!
#69937 by slinky09
19 Jul 2005, 17:08
Just been placed in a holding pattern by the VS team - my query cannot be answered yet because it 'has to be dealt with by another department'.

I will still keep an open mind until more detail emerges. Guess I'm in the middle 'cos I fly for business and pleasure and can see the benefit on short flights after work but not to the detriment of all. I was very interested in the comment on FlyerTalk that the BA policy was a factor in BA losing premier customers to the 'dark side', poor BA :D
#69938 by fozzyo
19 Jul 2005, 17:08
I'm just enjoying the fact that we have had our first V-Flyer Soap Opera here on V-Flyer. "Join is next time for the continuing story of the Good Night Service ..."

Like you newby, i'm waiting for some official word to come out of Crawley before pursuing the matter any further. But keeping an eye on this thread has made for some very enoyable reading while in work. :D

Foz xxx
#69941 by Vslf
19 Jul 2005, 17:19
Wouldn't this be a good time for VS to acknowledge this v-flyer and make a statement here and on the VS website maybe in the form of a FAQ covering some of the specific question/issues that have been raised.

In the spirit of cost saving V-flyer must save them quite a lot of time in answering questions that would normally be addressed to the customer service teams?;)

The lack of awareness within VS on this seems like a real cock-up between areas. Doesn't help them manage the situation when people phone up with queries knowing more about it than their own people do.

Vslf
#69949 by virgin is the best
19 Jul 2005, 18:21
I done a trial flight with this and it went down very well. A lot of crew know about the service and how it works and they are going to be online acting as service trainers.

I have not read right through this but if anyone wants to fire a few Qs at me if I can answer them I will to the best of my knowledge.

Does anyone remember the upper supper tray? Its a little like that.
#69951 by Nottingham Nick
19 Jul 2005, 18:28
Originally posted by virgin is the best

I have not read right through this but if anyone wants to fire a few Qs at me if I can answer them I will to the best of my knowledge.


The obvious question - which may, (or may not) put a lot of V-Flyer's minds at rest is 'Having experienced it for yourself, do you regard the introduction of this service as a costcutting exercise, or a reduction in the value of the product that is the Upper Class Suite?'

Nick
#69952 by Richard28
19 Jul 2005, 18:35
Originally posted by virgin is the best
I done a trial flight with this and it went down very well. A lot of crew know about the service and how it works and they are going to be online acting as service trainers.

I have not read right through this but if anyone wants to fire a few Qs at me if I can answer them I will to the best of my knowledge.

Does anyone remember the upper supper tray? Its a little like that.


Thanks!

Q1) Is this service planned to be throughout the cabin?
Q2) How do you fit syarter, main, roll and drink on one tray - are portions smaller?
Q3) How is main kept warm whilst starter eaten - some kind of lid?
Q4) What is served at the bar buffet for breakfast?
Q5) Was the bar busy at brakfast time?
Q6) by time hot tray is served, do the lights go out whilst eating meal?
Q7) What come first V:Port activation or lights out ;)
Q8) Do crew wander round cabin for congnacs etc post meal - or do we have to press call button?
Q9) Is desert choice only Ben & Jerrys ice cream - or do we have regular options in addition to this?

Might think of more questions later......!

Thanks in advance


Rich,
#69955 by virgin is the best
19 Jul 2005, 19:01
Originally posted by Richard28
Originally posted by virgin is the best
I done a trial flight with this and it went down very well. A lot of crew know about the service and how it works and they are going to be online acting as service trainers.

I have not read right through this but if anyone wants to fire a few Qs at me if I can answer them I will to the best of my knowledge.

Does anyone remember the upper supper tray? Its a little like that.


Thanks!

Q1) Is this service planned to be throughout the cabin?
Q2) How do you fit syarter, main, roll and drink on one tray - are portions smaller?
Q3) How is main kept warm whilst starter eaten - some kind of lid?
Q4) What is served at the bar buffet for breakfast?
Q5) Was the bar busy at brakfast time?
Q6) by time hot tray is served, do the lights go out whilst eating meal?
Q7) What come first V:Port activation or lights out ;)
Q8) Do crew wander round cabin for congnacs etc post meal - or do we have to press call button?
Q9) Is desert choice only Ben & Jerrys ice cream - or do we have regular options in addition to this?

Might think of more questions later......!

Thanks in advance


Rich,


WOW!! So many LOL

1. Yes its planned to right throughout the upper class cabin apart from snooze where it is offered.
2. On the Hot Supper Tray you will have your wine and water glass, A small oval plate with bread and butter on it, Salt and Pepper, A small piece of Choc, A large dinner plate with your main course on it and your strter in a small dish. All fits on the the tray well. Remember this is what we do at breakfast time so we know it works and nothing is smaller.
On the Cold Supper Tray you will have your wine and water glass, Small oval plate with bread and butter, Salt and Pepper, Small Choc, Large dish with salad and a small dish with Cheese and Fruit.
3.There is no lid to keep anything warm. (This may not have been thought of) I do know that no customers on the trial flights said anything about it.
4.Selection of Cereals,Warm Waffles with maple syrup,Butter Croissants and Lemeon cake served with preserves,Sesonal Fresh friut in lime syrup on its own or with yoghurt and the bacon roll.
5. The bar was like any other Breakfast time. No more busy and no less quiet.
6.No The lights will be set to a low setting,However they wont be so low you cant see what you are eating.
7.IFE comes first. There is the 2 other cabins to think aboout too not just J.
8.There is no after take off drinks service,However if you want one there is nothing stopping you asking a crew member there will be at least 4 in the cabin.
9.No there is more than one dessert it will be a special item which is chosen each week.
10. I dont see this as cost cutting. It will be saving on food wastage though. On a full flight out of the US we throw so much food away it hurts. You would not believe how much and also the mojorty of customers choose to sleep almost straight away. We only serve approx 10 full course meals on a short night flight from the USA.

Hope this helps. It really is a good service. The only downside is it will be a long flight for crew as there wont be much work.
#69957 by Richard28
19 Jul 2005, 19:13
thanks v. much for the quick response :)

a quick further few questions, you mention that this has alrady been trialed. What flights has it been trialed on - and was there only positive reaction from pax?

Also, one of my major concerns (and a few others here) is for the ultra long hauls to JNB, HKG and the VS24 LAX - has it been trialed on these services yet, and if yes, what was the reaction?

Finally, what portion of pax opted for each service (eg turn in, cold plate and hot plate) - and how has this varied by route?
#69964 by slinky09
19 Jul 2005, 19:57
Thanks for the feedback on the trials. Still doesn't answer the concerns about non East coast flights such as what if there is no club house? What's a passenger to do for 9 hours apart from keep pressing the call button for another glass of wine ... why should I have to get out of my seat/bed to get something ... what's wrong with the option of a multi course meal served with all the normal fanfare (and not just a rotating monthly pudding).

On the plus side, someone will have to install an IFE monitor for the crew to while away the boredom while passengers are strapped into their beds with nothing to do LOL

You may have read an earlier post that mentioned that BA lost customers when it enforced a similar regime on all passengers in club world, I wonder whether Virgin will experience the same. I'm already considering it when I have my next long haul and late leaving flight.
#69966 by Edna Cloud
19 Jul 2005, 20:07
Some more questions for "Virgin is the best" (or other crew member)...

How will you deal with someone who asks for their meal to be brought a little later? One of the reasons I ask is because I shall be travelling on one of the affected flights with an infant (shh! don't tell Blackcat ;)). I will want to look after the chapster first before I have anything. Will that be OK, or will the food just turn up and have to wait until I am ready?

I do wonder about serving the meal all on one tray. Won't the main course go cold whilst I am eating the starter? Won't the ice cream be soup by the time I get round to it?

Also, travelling with an infant, I would rather breakfast was brought to me than try to serve myself from the bar with said chapster under one arm. Will this be OK?

Thanks for offering to answer our questions.

E
#69970 by jaguarpig
19 Jul 2005, 20:25
I dont see this as cost cutting. It will be saving on food wastage though. On a full flight out of the US we throw so much food away it hurts. You would not believe how much and also the mojorty of customers choose to sleep almost straight away. We only serve approx 10 full course meals on a short night flight from the USA.


Think I pay for my food with my UC ticket even if I decide not to eat it.Well this minority of your customer base doesn't like to be told when to go to sleep and pays his hard earned cash over for a complete full service.A good seat alone does not make a good J product.
#69974 by mdvipond
19 Jul 2005, 21:10
Still thinking on the same lines as jaguarpig here - if, after paying through the nasal cavity for a J ticket, I have no choice of meal other than 'supper' on a tray before being told it's time to go beddy-byes, you would be looking at one very unhappy bunny (one who would soon be travelling with another airline). Great idea for those who want it, total deprivation of choice for those who want - and pay dearly for - the full mashings.
#69976 by mike-smashing
19 Jul 2005, 21:10
Originally posted by slinky09
Thanks for the feedback on the trials. Still doesn't answer the concerns about non East coast flights such as what if there is no club house?


Which is where VS missed the point slightly, I think - the locations without Clubhouses, but with shortish flights, like MIA and BOS. VS could have offered an expanded "snooze" area on those flights, offering the abbreviated "supper" service to those particular seats.

What's a passenger to do for 9 hours apart from keep pressing the call button for another glass of wine ...


I honestly think you're over-exaggerating things here - I'm sure that crew members will still walk the aisles after "lights out" keeping their eye out for pax who aren't sleeping, making sure that they are fed and watered in a reasonable manner!

Regards,
Mike
#69980 by fozzyo
19 Jul 2005, 21:24
Originally posted by jaguarpig
Think I pay for my food with my UC ticket even if I decide not to eat it.Well this minority of your customer base doesn't like to be told when to go to sleep and pays his hard earned cash over for a complete full service.A good seat alone does not make a good J product.


My thoughts exactly, i know i sound like a stuck record but i have paid for a full service J flight, and to Hong Kong I am not going to be in any rush to get to sleep! I'll be too excited and looking forward to my G&T with Pretzels on a dish to think about food.

Thankyou for the info VirginIsBest, that is much appreciated. And I have to say this has not put my mind at rest. I will await for a formal answer from Virgin through official channels before acting though. The fact this has been trialed only adds to the mystery why no-one in Premier Team, Customer Services or SRB's office know anything about it and haven't been able to confirm details.

Once this has been officially confirmed that it will be the entire cabin by Virgin I will be making written complaints to VS and SRB's office. I may well ask for a part refund, I booked a full service J flight to Sydney. I'm not getting that so is it unfair to expect a reduction in the cost? [V]

Foz xxx
#69984 by Scrooge
19 Jul 2005, 21:44
I can't wait to see what happens to the loads on the effected flights,still waiting to hear from my family about what they are going to do,but if can guess i'll say they will be flying BA or SSA rather than VS
Virgin Atlantic

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 175 guests

Itinerary Calendar