2nd Y meal - JFK, EWR, IAD & BOS Flights

[Nottingham Nick]

Has the second meal westbound to the East Coast cities changed recently?

According to a recent post on FT the second 'meal' consisted only of a pack of shortbread. [?][?]

VS have always given either a sandwich or a cob with cake or bag of fruit. I can't remember reading about any change to this, but haven't flown since February.

Nick



Title of thread amended to reflect topic under discussion... Nick

In easter we recieved a "sandwich" although it wasn't the best. However, I don't think that switching to a few bisciuts is acceptable. Maybe it was just an ops thing.
Anyway, I think that most people would be prepared to pay the extra pound or two to get a bit more substantial meal at the end.[:?]

VS.

I hope that is not the case... I wouldn't be impressed. The breakfasts are not good inbound as it is in economy on short flights.

The 2nd service has changed on the following routes:- JFK, EWR, BOS and IAD.

On flights from LHR the 2nd service is shortbread/brownie with tea or coffee.

On flights to the UK the 2nd service is cereal bar/muffin with tea or coffee.

[preiffer]

What was the previous Eastbound breakfast offering in Y?

I was told by the FSM on my flight today that they will be (or might have just started) offering coffee or tea for breakfast in disposable cups with lids so passengers can carry them off the plane.

They are designed to keep the coffee hot for a long period, this along with the cereal bar etc. is on a trial basis.

Jilly

Originally posted by Jetstreamer
The 2nd service has changed on the following routes:- JFK, EWR, BOS and IAD.

On flights from LHR the 2nd service is shortbread/brownie with tea or coffee.

On flights to the UK the 2nd service is cereal bar/muffin with tea or coffee.

Ouch!

Is there a compensatory improvement in the main meal, or does that remain the same? The mid-flight ice cream came back, right?

As for further demolition of breakfast, it's getting beyond a joke. (Unless the intention was to make breakfast so lame that people refused it, so that management could do away with it completely, because "no-one eats breakfast"?)

Originally posted by jilly
I was told by the FSM on my flight today that they will be (or might have just started) offering coffee or tea for breakfast in disposable cups with lids so passengers can carry them off the plane.

They are designed to keep the coffee hot for a long period, this along with the cereal bar etc. is on a trial basis.

I really don't like the idea of landing on an aircraft where passengers are still holding hot liquids. If someone in VS thinks that it's okay to land an aircraft while pax have cups of hot coffee in their hands, then they need their head examining. Have they never heard of a "secure cabin"?

Do the monkeys making the decisions think that people are too stupid to notice the cutbacks? I guess customer services are climbing into their flame-proof overalls!

Mike

Originally posted by Jetstreamer
The 2nd service has changed on the following routes:- JFK, EWR, BOS and IAD.

On flights from LHR the 2nd service is shortbread/brownie with tea or coffee.

On flights to the UK the 2nd service is cereal bar/muffin with tea or coffee.

WOW! that will really fill you up! what are VS thinking! you cant only get one meal and shortbread/cereal bar ([:$]) e.t.c. on longhaul![n]

[mcmbenjamin]

Naww. They are simply trying to make economy more upmarket and closer to the likes of EOS with the 'bagged breakfast.' VS just helping out clients again.....right.

I do understand perhaps downsizing the second service but grab 'n go seems silly...and I agree about the potential issues around hot cups of coffee in the hands of those juggling bags, passports and scrum. I, for one, would be quite annoyed if one of those hot cups emptied itself on me or my baggage and would be mortified if I were responsible for doing the same to someone else (a not unlikely possibility as I have a long history of pouring coffee on myself whilst driving to important meetings in my go-to-meetings clothes.

Why not a simple cup of yogurt, oj and one or two rounds of quite needed tea/coffee? I imagine this decision was made based on waste, but ugh--- cereal bars??? How is that different from everyone else? The VS muffins have always been (to my taste) dreadful but possibly an even draw with cereal bars. People deplaning after a 5 hour time zone change need a light protein meal and a lot of caffeine, especially if they spent the short flight playing video games....

What's BA serving? [n]


RR

RR

[mcmbenjamin]

Good point RR but consider that ceral bars and muffins are prepackaged. Tea and coffee are cheap to make. Yogurt and OJ have a short useful life then expire and get trashed. Bars and muffins can be restocked if not used.

These days the flight times are fairly quick on flights from New York, IAD and BOS.

Feedback has shown the customers are not eating much of the breakfast so now for breakfast you are offered a muffin or a cereal bar with a cup of Tea or Coffee served a large carboard cup similar to those found in Starbucks.

Outbound you get the main meal, ice cream mid flight and then either shortbread or a cake prior to landing.

All other flights remain the same, although Lagos will soon get the new service too as the flight time is quick.

In a way it makes sense we throw away so many muffins and fruit everyday because after the short east coast flights many passengers prefer to sleep and miss breakfast or eat one or the other.

Simply put, more cost cutting. Guess this doesn't extend to UC but does also to PE?

What's wrong with choice?

I got offered a brownie on my recent IAD Flight.

Cant comment on the inbound as I wasnt in Y

Personally I prefer a light sandwich as 8 hrs is still a long time for one meal on a plane..

I'm not impressed either. Flights from JFK normally mean a meal in the clubhouse and declining the main meal so by 5 hours later I'm ravenous and ready to eat the seats.

Think I'll bring a box of cereal and some milk wth me on the next flight and whip up something myself.

I understand the point about wastage but surely there is a better way to cut back - offering a decent breakfast to a subset of the it's gone it's gone. Please at least keep a decent breakfast for PE.

Phil

I kind of agree with Virgins policy on reducing the offering for breakfast on the shorter eastbound flights as I noticed when I came back from MIA that very few people had breakfast - it was mostly a hot drink and a muffin. I guess they can only base their decisions on the uptake of the breakfast offer currently.

However - the way forward for them should be to forecast the uptake of breakfast based upon previous requirements and carry the necessary items - there would undoubtedly be some pax who would not get there choice but good forecasting would ultimately get this pretty accurate. Therefore I woudl suggest a selction of full breakfasts and muffines etc.

This ensures that the VS product is kept the same and reduces wasteage where pax dont want the full offer.

With regard to Westbound flights I think its a little more difficult for VS to justify - I think after 5 hours a sandwich is welcome and I dont seem to recall many declining it? Sorry - but its cost cutting at its very worst!!

And as to whether PE should get the current service I think its a difficult one - we often see posts on here about "making a differece" and this woudl indeed do that - however - I personally think that we should be supporting the best possible service for Y class and then trying to get improvements for PE.

And I do often take a few nibbles with me anyway - just in case!!

[fozzyo]

I wonder how much of the throw away is down to quality? The Y cooked breakfasts are renowned for being fairly awful and the cereal bar idea idea for me is [:$]. I'm a big fan of breakfast - can't function without it so isn't something I like to miss. Maybe something more appetising would be welcomed.

Not sure about the carboard cup for coffee, like others i have been known to have problems with coffee cups. Like the time I walked into my office plate glass door with a full v. large starbucks Mocha. I smelt like chocolaty-coffee the rest of the day!! And that was after a good night sleep. So negotiating the cabin scram, immigration, baggage claim, customs and getting home with a coffee isn't going to work. I mean what do you do when you want to get up and get your our stuff from the locker along with everyone else around you - where do you put the coffee?

Actually thinking about it - why are they using cardboard cups? You can't leave people with hot steaming coffee in their hands for landing so they are going to have to collect the cups back.

Mat xxx

I wonder why the pre-packed individual servings of cereal - the ones which come already in their own disposeable bowl, where you just pull the lid off - couldn't be served?

As long as they aren't packaged with milk, they don't need refrigeration, and any unused items can be de-stocked at the end of the flight and re-issued on another trip.

You just keep the milk (in small individual cartons) seperate, and serve that as required when people want cereal.

So, you could provide a choice of cereal, muffin or breakfast cereal-bar, or nothing. All of those can have sufficiently long shelf-lives so can be de-stocked and re-issued, if wastage really is an issue.

Paper cups I can partly understand. It reduces washing-up.

In fact, one key thing with this new service is that it removes the need for a tray setup. It's all disposeable, pre-packed/wrapped, and doesn't need cutlery. That itself is probably a key driver.

I can remember the days when UA used to do a half-decent continental brekkie in Y. I've not travelled in the back Internationally on UA for a good few years (being UA Premier Exec means you either upgrade on miles beforehand, or land an op-up much of the time), and it's probably a shadow of it's former self, but I'm sure I've still seen them handing out fresh (not syrup preserved) fruit (usually melon and grapes) and warmed croissants. ISTR that's either served in a box, or doesn't require a tray setup.

The cereal above wouldn't require a tray setup. Just a spoon and paper napkin. Maybe in a bag you can put your trash in when you're done?

I'm with Foz on the quality aspect. The conspiracy theorist in me definitely wonders if the breakfast has been deliberately eroded and reduced in quality so that it's refused? You get increased wastage, and a self-fulfilling prophecy.

Cheers,
Mike

My recent outbound Y flight to Miami was a main meal of sausage and Mash. A choice of sandwich mid flight with a chocolate bar and also an ice cream. There did not appear to be any cuting back from previous flights.

The return from Orlando was BBQ chicken for dinner with a breakfast of a muffin and fruit. It was very basic. Perhaps people don't much feel like eating at this time with body clocks out of line.

Originally posted by Jetstreamer
The 2nd service has changed on the following routes:- JFK, EWR, BOS and IAD.

On flights from LHR the 2nd service is shortbread/brownie with tea or coffee.

On flights to the UK the 2nd service is cereal bar/muffin with tea or coffee.

Only these routes FV!

[HighFlyer]

Originally posted by Jetstreamer
The 2nd service has changed on the following routes:- JFK, EWR, BOS and IAD.

On flights from LHR the 2nd service is shortbread/brownie with tea or coffee.

On flights to the UK the 2nd service is cereal bar/muffin with tea or coffee.

Ouch!

Personally, i think its a pretty poor showing from VS and screams cost-cutting.

When i flew out to IAD in March the full sandwich option was still there and that is about what i would expect. I guess there is always the equilibrium between offering another service to the passengers and keeping costs down, but i'd like to think that i'd get something more than a a few pieces of shortbread before landing, especially given that the tea and coffee is usually pretty dire in Y - and no comments as to how filling the main entree is.

And i cant say im too excited about the prospect of how many hundred passengers disembarking the aircraft with a hot cup of take away coffee in their hands. These are the same people who cant seem to keep control of a large suitcase in their posession for goodness sake!

I trust that the Afternoon Tea service in J has not had the 'bean counter' affect also?

Thanks,
Sarah

Good point RR but consider that ceral bars and muffins are prepackaged.

Yes, I'm sure that's the engine driving all this, as it eliminates any actual meal service. I agree too that a nice small tea sandwich is welcome on shorter daytime flights as a second service. However these have to be consumed onboard as aren't allowed through customs (beware the dairy/meat/fruit sniffing beagle at Logan).

The value 2nd service is the one that comes after a cramped Y hour or two of sleep when it's really 2:30 a.m. body clock time and 6:30 arrival. Having a bit of time to harness whatever energy can be mustered while having two cups of good tea and a small bite that says "breakfast" to ease the shock to the system, is most welcome, especially for those facing an hour or two of line benders on arrival at LHR customs hall. Would be nice to receive a warm wake-up towel in Y as well....but that was yesteryear.

When I talk VS up to colleagues and friends, I apologize for the dreadful Y seats but am proud to claim that Y pax are still given a full meal and beverage service. If VS go to cheapening the product to look like the competition (hello? can we name all the US carriers who offer a cereal bar as though it is a prize in a basket?) then it's a hard sell to rationalize why anyone should pay a premium price as VS so often is, especially in summer. Additonally, I would be quite miffed to pay PE prices for the same (recalling the "varietal white" wine served in Y and PE last flight that guaranteed no one topped up).

Not saying that a cereal bar versus a light meal would be the yay or nay factor (safety record, on time and fun are big plusses) but it does make a difference in the overall sense of value as it is the last memory pax have on deplaning.
Possibly mentioned in another thread but did anyone have an opp to listen to the what was I think on the NOW show a few weeks ago about VS Upper class--where they did a skit ad on the new VS "working class" fare? The one where they offered seatback pianos instead of video for a singalong down back? Perhaps it wasn't such a stretch.

I'm sure VS have costed this move out as a mega savings effort and best wishes to that, but surely there are ways and there are ways.

Oy, now I sound like a fussy neighbor complaining to the council about plans to remove a row of nasty rhododendrons in front of the library. But still....

back to work,

RR

Well on a plus point it is nice to get a LARGE cup of Tea/Coffee instead of the small cup your currently get.

Also we still collect in any rubbish once the service is completed.

Anyway the service is done around 90 mins before landing so by the time you are served and then finally land it would probably be pretty cold.

That idea of encouraging people to take it off with them is pretty crazy.

Can you imagine landing trying to balance a hot drink then trying to get your hand luggage out of an overhead locker and then navigating an economy aisle and then taking the drink off the plane!!??

Finally its great to hear your opionions but try it out before you come to a decision.

Personally i think we should do a snack after take off and then a nice hot breakfast before landing into UK just like EK do on flights to and from DXB.

Originally posted by declansmith
Well on a plus point it is nice to get a LARGE cup of Tea/Coffee instead of the small cup your currently get.

Coffee and Tea are not really suitable for kids whereas the old breakfast was.

Originally posted by declansmith

Personally i think we should do a snack after take off and then a nice hot breakfast before landing into UK just like EK do on flights to and from DXB.

Personally I think this is a great idea so long as it is made clear to passengers that they should eat before boarding or bring something on with them.

Phil

Maybe we should go to paying for food in Y. Then, if you actually want something, you can have it and it might be at least half edible/filling and if you don't want anything then you save money.
But please VS, lets not occupy this half-way house between legacy and low-cost - one way or the other please, not a bad combination of both![:0]

VS.