Virgin Atlantic / BMI / Lufthansa again

Link to Forbes.com

FRANKFURT (Thomson Financial) - Virgin Atlantic aims to merge with BMI British Midlands and is pushing Deutsche Lufthansa AG., which holds 30 percent minus one share in the carrier, to agree to the deal, Sueddeutsche Zeitung reported, citing Virgin's external affairs and route development director Barry Humphreys.
'We are very interested in a merger with BMI,' Humphreys told the newspaper, saying Lufthansa could hold a stake in the new merged entity..........















Thread title altered for clarity and copyrighted material trimmed down by mod ........ Nick

There was a large thread on a.net about this. My conclusion is I don't really buy it at all.

Im not sure if you are allowed to post the article as you have due to copyright rules?!?

Is there any wonder VS are having a poor time of it if they have Dame Edna Everidge on the staff!!![:p]

I'll shut up then and get myself over to planespotters.net. [:?]

Originally posted by crewrest
I'll shut up then and get myself over to planespotters.net. [:?]

Sorry CR I wasn't trying to shoot you down.

It seems every day VS wants BD again or LH wants VS or SQ is fed up with VS. All of this is rumour and often has no weight or is written poorly by journalists.

Rumours have been circulating for c.8 years about BD being taken over by VS but still it hasn't happened. One would imagine the private nature of VS, in that it doesn't have to post financial results etc, is helping to fuel rumours.

Put it this way I will believe it when I see SRB stand up and say he is in merger talks.

Originally posted by willd
Put it this way I will believe it when I see SRB stand up and say he is in merger talks.

Well not quite but:

This story

This story

You're right, it has been going on for years, poor SMB, now is probably not the right time to sell and get a better price than he comitted to LH.

Willd; no offence taken. [;)]

Just thought start the rumour again!

No mention of Virgin in the latest news

This article appeared in my inbox this morning http://www.cityam.com/index.php?news=14276

[Darren Wheeler]

being picky here, but tie- up and merger are different things.

[Nottingham Nick]

I will merge this thread with the existing Lufthansa / BMI / VS thread to avoid duplicate discussions.

Nick

Originally posted by Darren Wheeler
being picky here, but tie- up and merger are different things.

Exactly and one of the problems with less knowledgable journalists writing this kind of piece.

Tie Up would ensue a codeshare agreement of some sort.

Merger well thats fairly obvious isn't.


TBH we continue to hear these rumours but with no concrete proof. Its almost as if when their is no aviation business news 'lets do a bit on VS/BD/LH'.

Originally posted by willd
TBH we continue to hear these rumours but with no concrete proof. Its almost as if when their is no aviation business news 'lets do a bit on VS/BD/LH'.

I know exactly what you mean Will, SMB is probably bored and fed up of hearing the same rumours every few months and so and saying the same thing over and over again whether he gets asked about a possible merger/takeover/tie-up with the usual suspects etc.

This time however, I think that the noises being made by Virgin and Lufthansa are the loudest yet. With the current global economic climate as it is, and seeing several US carriers (some of which were long established carriers) go bust within the space of a few weeks and combined with the merger of Delta and NWA, it will guarantee the future of SMB's airline. He will be kicking himself a few years down the line if he doesn't do anything now.

Originally posted by VS075
This time however, I think that the noises being made by Virgin and Lufthansa are the loudest yet. With the current global economic climate as it is, and seeing several US carriers (some of which were long established carriers) go bust within the space of a few weeks and combined with the merger of Delta and NWA, it will guarantee the future of SMB's airline. He will be kicking himself a few years down the line if he doesn't do anything now.

Agree.

I did hear a rumour that SMB would be willing to part with BD if WW did not go with the deal so that he could keep it. THat was a while back though and would make no sense now given current climate. I would imagine WW would not be part of the deal and that BE would snap them up pretty damn quick.

Interesting though I wonder how much of this spin is a leak from VS. If/when BD gets taken over by LH, LH will have the necessary slots to move in and dominate LHR (apart from BA). A quick look at the BD route map shows that they are not interested in BD due to its ability to feed into LH at FRA and MUC.

There will be nothing stopping LH going head to head on Long Haul routes or even dropping the vast majority of BD short haul routes to allow this to happen.

I think VS by claiming they are 'interested in a tie up with LH' are trying very hard to make sure they are ok if LH get BD.

Scenario A: VS sit back say nothing/do nothing and LH get BD. LH move into LHR and under cut VS consistently, offer better service, better flight times, *a miles etc. VS hits hard times as pax leave in droves or is taken over by LH.

Scenario B: VS make it known in the press that they want a codeshare/tie up. LH get BD and agree not to go head to head with VS. Instead they create a worldwide partnership. The newly formed BD/LH concentrates on mid haul markets, South America, secondary US airports/far East. VS left to do what is doing now. Result: VS stays.

Clearly I have made it very simplistic but I would not be surprised if this is what VS is thinking.

I like your analysis Will and to add to that any potential partnership / bid / union between VS and BD/LH gives VS access to what it needs most - slots. With all these aircraft on order there's currently nowhere for them to fly from other that LGW or MAN or GLA ... but the premium traffic is still from LHR.

So I see slots as being be primary driver for VS in alliance with BD/LH, other than trying to buy BD itself but frankly LH would be insane not to if the stories about the deal they have struck are true. And, if they are, poor MB must be kicking himself ... if CO can spend $200m on 2 pairs of slots just think what BD's total must be worth now!

Virgin's reply.

ÒWe talk to a lot of people all the time. There is nothing concrete behind this [newspaper story]Ó

[preiffer]

Originally posted by slinky09
if CO can spend $200m on 2 pairs of slots just think what BD's total must be worth now!

Roughly £770m [;)]