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#16573 by Howard Long
04 Dec 2006, 00:47
... and sat in a seat two behind me about an hour before landing. After three or four crew spend several minutes each pampering him, he is left on his own and then proceeds to repeatedly push all the buttons, slamming the table shut numerous times, and of course the old perennial seat kicking comes into play. The crew continue to do nothing but give him a load of 'bless him' type verbal attention.

After about twenty minutes of banging, my blood was well and truly boiling, so I asked a passing FA: "Is that child alright?" to which the answer was "Yes". So I pushed a little more - "He's kicking the seat and making a lot of noise" to which the answer has "I'm sure he's alright". So, as subtlety and diplomacy wasn't going to win the day I understated "It's rather irritating". So the FA went and got another FA (whom I assume was the parent or guardian) to shut him up - which thankfully worked.

I had made the mistake of sitting in 18A in the zone of rows 15 to 20 in the 744. The tempter was that this section was barely half full unlike the other two sections that were full. And 18A had a 100% satisfaction rating on the seat ratings screen (until now!). I found that the two empty seats behind me were used as a temporary sitting area for three different folks who had at least some VS connection by the way the crew were discussing things in depth with them. Problem was that of course I kept getting woken up when the next one turned up to settle in and have a chat, of course one that I could fully hear. Not even the old stalwart combo of ear plugs and Bose noise cancellers could stop it.

Reminds me of another VS19 flight I had in October when there was a significant contingent of Virgin staff on a company freebie. A colleague and I had sat down at the empty bar to have a discussion about a conference we were both presenting at. A short while later a couple of the VS guys came to sit down too, but then an increasing number of their mates encroached on the bar area. Now of course I don't have a problem with VS staff having a good time, but after half an hour or so it was clear that the contingent were on a mission. In the end the nature and volume of the conversations they were having really made it impossible for us to continue and it was clear as it became two and then three deep at the bar we were rather getting in the way of their fun, so we reluctantly gave up and returned to our seats. All rather dissapointing really.

Cheers, Howard
#149979 by Nottingham Nick
04 Dec 2006, 09:32
Stories like this, with staff making more than they should of their perks - and giving preferential treatment to friends and family, used to be very frequent on V-Flyer, and became quite a major issue.

I am sorry to see it raise its head again, and can understand your irritation, Howard. I think that everyone accepts that VS staff are not that well paid and the travel perks are part and parcel of the job, but paying pax shouldn't be affected, and any 'unofficial' upgrades should be done in a very subtle manner.

In previous threads, staffers who post on V-Flyer were very quick to point out that it is very much against company rules. Maybe it is worth a letter to SRB's office?

Nick
#149984 by mysteryflyer
04 Dec 2006, 10:10
Just to give another side.. And not at all to imply that the OP was like this...

We were on a flight with our 2 children all in Y. The persons in front made a huge amount of noise about our kids who as far as I could tell were as usual perfectly well behaved. So much so that the IFS asked them to behave - on no evidence apart from the moaners in front complaining. Our two had just as much 'right' to enjoy PE as the people sitting in front. My wife was very upset by the whole thing . The moaners continued to complain and try to make the flight a misery for us as far as I can tell simply to try to get an upgrade / make a customer complaint.
#149987 by Nottingham Nick
04 Dec 2006, 10:44
Originally posted by mysteryflyer
Just to give another side..


Whilst I don't disagree with what you have said, I don't think your post is putting 'another side' in the debate.

As I read it, Howard's post isn't about children per se... it is about people who are in a premium cabins 'unofficially', abusing this perk.

Whether the person kicking the seat is 4 or 44, isn't the issue IMHO.

I agree with your sentiments about children. In my experience, most of the 'infantile' antics that I see on flights are performed by people who are certainly old enough to know better. [V][:I]

Nick
#150034 by Howard Long
04 Dec 2006, 14:48
Originally posted by Nottingham Nick

Whilst I don't disagree with what you have said, I don't think your post is putting 'another side' in the debate.

As I read it, Howard's post isn't about children per se... it is about people who are in a premium cabins 'unofficially', abusing this perk.


OK, here's another one. I was looking forward to taking 1K on my way back yesterday on the VS20. Row 1 usually seems not to be available to pre-assign until check in, but they show open on ExpertFlyer. When I checked in online earlier I was fully expecting 1K to be available, but it wasn't to be. I called up UC reservations where they said it was blocked off, probably a broken seat or maybe crew rest. When I checked my bag at the airport I asked again, and was told it was still blocked off, with the broken seat reason given.

For grins in the lounge I checked a few times to see if it really was going to be taken, but no, it was still showing free on ExpertFlyer, right up to 30 minutes before scheduled departure, so maybe it really was a broken seat.

It will come as no surprise that a VS staffer in civvies was sitting in 1K there when I got to my seat, 2K, so I couldn't resist the opportunity to comment on how I'd tried to get the seat and that they must be someone really special to get it. [?]

In fact, you can check for yourself if you ask ExpertFlyer for the seat map for SFO-LHR VS20 on 3 Dec where 1K is still showing free.

[Off topic: I did find out why they mark your ticket and lounge pass "G" if you're flying on a non-rev ticket - it's so they can find you more easily on the manifest which is sorted by fare code.]

Cheers, Howard
#150042 by AndyK
04 Dec 2006, 15:14
Howard - cheers for that last bit of info, was wondering that when I was last at SFO. I did worry for a minute it was a nudge to provide a worse service!
#150045 by Howard Long
04 Dec 2006, 15:32
Originally posted by AndyK
Howard - cheers for that last bit of info, was wondering that when I was last at SFO. I did worry for a minute it was a nudge to provide a worse service!


I have noticed that they sometimes mark your boarding pass at LHR too, but not always. I am sure that they may well do it elsewhere. Certainly I have never noticed a dregradation in service on a G ticket, usually accumulating enough mileage to take a couple of non-rev returns in UC each year.

Howard
#150065 by Tim
04 Dec 2006, 20:06
OK, here's another one


From our recent trip from JFK (VS026)on 18th November.
The previous evenings MIA-LHR flight had been diverted to JFK due to engine problems. Most of these passengers were trying to get on our flight.
Sitting in PE a VS staffer/family/friend was told by one of the CC that he may have to give up his seat and leave the plane. A few minutes later another member of the crew spoke to him and said that they were trying to keep him on the flight and that he should sit tight and say nothing.
He was allowed to stay... Remaining passengers from the MIA flight were put on later flights.
#150066 by mitchja
04 Dec 2006, 20:14
Originally posted by Howard Long
Originally posted by AndyK
Howard - cheers for that last bit of info, was wondering that when I was last at SFO. I did worry for a minute it was a nudge to provide a worse service!


I have noticed that they sometimes mark your boarding pass at LHR too, but not always. I am sure that they may well do it elsewhere. Certainly I have never noticed a dregradation in service on a G ticket, usually accumulating enough mileage to take a couple of non-rev returns in UC each year.

Howard


They are still doing that annoying trick of printing reward booking BC's with a Flying Club number '00500500500' nonsense, hence your FC status is lost when flying on any reward fare. It's also the reason why you can no longer click on a link to view reward bookings online and have to manually enter details to view reward flights.

Regards
#150092 by VS045
04 Dec 2006, 22:15
I think that pax can abuse their "right" to be sat wherever as well - we all hear tell of some 40 going on 6 year old who makes a huge fuss out of nothing.

VS.
#150096 by Juliet
04 Dec 2006, 22:29
I will say that if any Staffers have upgrades in their booking, and the cabin is mostly full, aside from inoperative seats, the staffer will be allocated this, as they did not 'pay' for the flight.
#150099 by VS045
04 Dec 2006, 22:36
Don't mean to be rude, Juliet, but could you clarify your point please[:I][:I][:I] - I'm a bit thick really;)[}:)]

VS.
#150100 by Juliet
04 Dec 2006, 22:43
If a staff member is travelling (on business or leisure) and is entitled to a 'staff perk' upgrade, these are always only on a space available basis.
If the only space is a 'broken seat' (or there is a paying passenger in the broken seat... and a non-broken one available) they will give the 'broken' seat to the staff member.

- or in other words - IF a staff member is upgraded, for whatever reason, it is on a space available basis. If there is a broken seat in the cabin of upgrade.... (and there are no others spare) the Staff member would be put into the broken seat, rather than a paying passenger.

Does that help clear my earlier comment up?
#150101 by Denzil
04 Dec 2006, 22:45
It's one of the last perks to being in the airline industry & i can 90% guarantee that the people who abuse their (space available) upgrade are office dwellers & not those that work at the coal face (crew, engineers etc).

Never heard of booking your seat though, even on a duty ticket (i.e one that had a true value), you only ever had a space available upgrade & the seat would frequently only be offered at the gate.
#150103 by Juliet
04 Dec 2006, 22:47
Originally posted by Denzil
It's one of the last perks to being in the airline industry & i can 90% guarantee that the people who abuse their (space available) upgrade are office dwellers & not those that work at the coal face (crew, engineers etc).

Never heard of booking your seat though, even on a duty ticket (i.e one that had a true value), you only ever had a space available upgrade & the seat would frequently only be offered at the gate.


I suspect that broken seat with the 'staffer in civvies' WAS allocated at the gate, although had probably been earmarked for possible use as such....
#150173 by Howard Long
05 Dec 2006, 11:20
Originally posted by Juliet
Originally posted by Denzil
It's one of the last perks to being in the airline industry & i can 90% guarantee that the people who abuse their (space available) upgrade are office dwellers & not those that work at the coal face (crew, engineers etc).

Never heard of booking your seat though, even on a duty ticket (i.e one that had a true value), you only ever had a space available upgrade & the seat would frequently only be offered at the gate.


I suspect that broken seat with the 'staffer in civvies' WAS allocated at the gate, although had probably been earmarked for possible use as such....


Well there was nothing wrong with the seat - the IFE, recline and sleep position all worked perfectly as far as I could see. I am unsure whether it was allocated at the gate or "allocated by blocking off". From the nature of the conversations, my instinct was such that this was an office dweller from the slight unfamiliarity of the features on board, such as the sleep suit.

Here's a further question: when boarding, I frequently see a few people sitting at the bar drinking the good stuff rather than taking their seats. Dare I ask if these are the opportunistic VS staffers...? If so, good luck to them, I know I'd be doing the same.

Please, please don't misunderstand me, I don't have a problem at all with VS employees enjoying their perks. I just object to it when it's to the detriment of the bone fide pax.

Cheers, Howard
#150180 by Juliet
05 Dec 2006, 12:44
Often times at boarding, on the 744's the people at the bar are seated in Premium economy on those exits. As they need to keep those areas clear when people are boarding, they often offer a drink or two at the bar.
#150182 by Scrooge
05 Dec 2006, 12:59
Originally posted by Juliet
Often times at boarding, on the 744's the people at the bar are seated in Premium economy on those exits. As they need to keep those areas clear when people are boarding, they often offer a drink or two at the bar.


Just to confirm what Juliet is saying, this has happened to me a number of times, this also used to happen when I was flying in Y in the old config for the LHR aircraft...a very nice way to start a flight I may add [y]
#150183 by ukcobra
05 Dec 2006, 13:25
Originally posted by Juliet
Often times at boarding, on the 744's the people at the bar are seated in Premium economy on those exits. As they need to keep those areas clear when people are boarding, they often offer a drink or two at the bar.


Those seats are very popular, you can get a good 3 or 4 glasses in before take off, and be one of the first off the plane !
#150186 by Howard Long
05 Dec 2006, 13:38
Originally posted by Juliet
Often times at boarding, on the 744's the people at the bar are seated in Premium economy on those exits. As they need to keep those areas clear when people are boarding, they often offer a drink or two at the bar.


It never ceases to amaze me how much VS trivia there is to know and find out! I haven't travelled PE for ten years or more (ISTR it was called Mid Class the last time I travelled) so forgive me.

Cheers, Howard
#150189 by jaguarpig
05 Dec 2006, 13:56
Those seats are very popular, you can get a good 3 or 4 glasses in before take off, and be one of the first off the plane !

We always used to go for that pair of seats when in W on LHR routes[y]
#150245 by Denzil
05 Dec 2006, 21:08
I always have & always will treat the staff travel perk with the utmost respect, sadly as mentioned others don't. The paying punter SHOULD always come first, but there are always people trying (and succeeding) back door deals for upgrades etc & i've often been stuck in Y or W knowing full well that a staffer in J didn't have the required length of service or job grade to be there!!! Other airlines are VERY, VERY strict when it comes to staff travel, EK for instance only allow staff of certain job grades to travel in J or above & being unofficially upgraded is a serious disciplinary offence.
#150258 by RichardMannion
05 Dec 2006, 22:47
James, when did you see the 00500 FC pad issue as that should have gone away?

Thanks,
Richard
#150279 by preiffer
06 Dec 2006, 01:17
Originally posted by RichardMannion
James, when did you see the 00500 FC pad issue as that should have gone away?

Thanks,
Richard
Mike had a 00500500500 reference when he was travelling as my "companion" in J last year to LAS... [:?]
#150281 by Howard Long
06 Dec 2006, 01:37
Originally posted by RichardMannion
James, when did you see the 00500 FC pad issue as that should have gone away?

Thanks,
Richard


It was on both my boarding cards this last weekend.

Howard
Virgin Atlantic

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