ANA 747's

In a thread on airliners.net, somebody mentioned a rumor going around that VS might be getting some ex ANA 744's. Is this just airliners.net talk or has anybody else heard this too?

I haven't heard anything like that and v-flyer has had its fair share of a/c rumours lately - I should think it's just a.net;)

VS.

Given that you saw it in the "VS Rumour" thread I would say it is just that.

The ANA bit makes no sense when you consider the aircraft would have to be refitted etc- if VS are gagging for a/c as much as we are lead to believe- then why are they selling off the older 343s instead of refitting them?!!

AS VS45 says there are loads of VS rumours flying around.

The rumour is doing the rounds at VS & may be fuelled by the requirement for expansion of leisure routes (eg LGW & MAN) & the B744 is the aircraft of choice. As for the source of aircraft ANA makes a lot of sense in that the aircraft are powered by CF6 engines, others available are powered by RB211 (SAA) & PW4056 (SQ & United).

My only reservation is that this isn't a good time to pick up a "cheap" used B744. The delay in delivery of the A380 & the popularity of the BCF is making used B744's very attractive. Use CX as an example, they have always operated RB211 B744's but have taken a few ex SQ B744's with PW4056 engines recently.

Heard a rumour recently that Air Atlanta bought 4 ex ANA B744's weeks before the announcement of the A380 delays & sold them on at a nice profit without even operating them.

Originally posted by DenzilHeard a rumour recently that Air Atlanta bought 4 ex ANA B744's weeks before the announcement of the A380 delays & sold them on at a nice profit without even operating them.

2 of them was for Travel City Direct, but that isn't happening now. They originally bought 6 and only got round to converting 2 to cargo config.

Not sure of others but TF-AMI is ex SQ & was converted by Bedek (B747-400SF). As for VS, apparently there are a few ANA B744's coming up for lease.

Slightly O/T but how long would it take to refit a used 747 to virgin spec. ie interior only.

thanks


David

So much for that theory. ANA just announced an order for three more B777-300ER to replace three B744's. The three B744's to join the Oasis fleet in HKG.

I doubt SRB will be buying anything.

We have no cash to spare apparently... [ii]

Originally posted by FlyCC
I doubt SRB will be buying anything.

We have no cash to spare apparently... [ii]

Is that because SRB has a new hobby, bashing Sky and building up another network. If so that's a real shame ...

Interesting to read FlyCC saying that VS is not going to buy anything, while according to this source (http://news.cheapflights.co.uk/flights/ ... _choo.html), SRB is going to make an order within next month!

It is not clear from this article, what offers are on the table from Boeing and Airbus. If VS wants anything quick, surely it won't be A350 or A380, guess what, as A340 orders have been postponed, A330 seems the only option to go for.

As B777 production line is so tight, B748 will have shorter waiting list. The problem is, if you have A380s, why you want B748 at the same time? B787 will be another option for VS but waiting time is quite a problem.

For short term a/c solution, leasing ANA 747s is a good option if VS can get hold of some. If VS really want to order some new aircrafts with a viewing of delivering time around 2008-2013, A330/B748/B787 will be the choices, and A330 seems more logical and less risk in terms of delay for delivery.

[Scrooge]

The problem with that is the wait times on the 330 and the 787 are now stretching out past 2013, if Boeing opens up a second 787 line then maybe, but off the top of my head the first new aircraft slots open are for the 777 and that is 2011, now of course the wild card is the 748.

Waiting time for new aircraft is a big problem via both Airbus and Boeing.

Second hand market might be the only way to go given some of the delivery times being quoted...

If VS want to continue their year on year growth, they aren't likely to want to wait 3 years plus for a suitable aircrfat type other than the B748...

I personally think all of this talk about new aircraft is nothing more than hype.

The facts as it stands are:
- VS has stated that it is delaying its growth by only expanding 10% this year
- A380s have been deffered
- Remaining 346's have been deffered.

Nowhere in anything coming out of VS is there talk of canceling of orders or indeed placing new orders. Remember VS did a very long and detailed examination of A v B prior to the order of the 346's and I would imagine it has since been done with the 380 order and the retirement of some of the 343s.

The current route structure can be served by the a/c currently in the fleet...remember VS Ops department (one of which was aformer member on here back in the day) are very good at getting the most amount of hours out of the a/c.

As much as I would love a new plane order from VS I really dont see it happening...VS has invested heavily in the 346, Boeing and Airbus delivery slots for the 777 and 330 are full and VS has all the a/c needed for operations currently hence the delayed delivery of the 346.

The best bet for these ANA 744s is that they end up in the colours of Cargolux or Emirates Skycargo...

The thing to remember is that Branson needs to be seen as going GREEN!

They will be pax aircraft for Oasis, other aircraft are going the BCF route. Emirates SkyCargo don't have any B747's, they belong to Atlas.

AS for new aircraft, the A346 could be transferred to A330 slots & i believe VS have some options to do this.

As for "Remember VS did a very long and detailed examination of A v B prior to the order of the 346's", it wasn't a very good one was it????

Originally posted by Denzil
They will be pax aircraft for Oasis, other aircraft are going the BCF route. Emirates SkyCargo don't have any B747's, they belong to Atlas.

Am aware that Emirates Skycargo a/c are from Atlas it was just an example- not to be take literally.

AS for new aircraft, the A346 could be transferred to A330 slots & i believe VS have some options to do this.

Most airlines can do this and have it written into their contracts from the start- so nothing unusual about that. Other public examples include B6 and U2 I believe.

As for "Remember VS did a very long and detailed examination of A v B prior to the order of the 346's", it wasn't a very good one was it????

Now lets not make this an A v B thread! I guess by this you are saying that VS selected the wrong a/c. If thats the case then so did IB, LH and SA plus any other 343 carrier. Just because the majority have gone for the 777 doesn't mean that VS got it wrong- each airline has its own specific needs.

Whilst I take it you are talking from an engineering pov- we must remember that we don't know what kind of deal was struck between VS and Airbus and the politics behind the deal. I would imagine the price and the chance to be one of the launch customers for the a/c had a heavy influence on VS going Airbus.

The A346 was the point in hand NOT the A343. The panache of being launch customer for an aircraft that was far from ready for service is an experience VS won't repeat in a hurry.

As for reasons for & against, cost of purchase is less for the A346 (IB & SA) & i think LH see the bigger picture & realise they are keeping money in the EU by going Airbus (obviously not the only reason).

The A346 will make a great freighter though!!!!!

Originally posted by Denzil
The A346 was the point in hand NOT the A343. The panache of being launch customer for an aircraft that was far from ready for service is an experience VS won't repeat in a hurry.

I agree- not a mistake VS will be making again.

I think the common cockpit between the 343 and 346 was a big carrot for VS as well- saved a lot of money on retraining/recruitment for 777 pilots etc