Cheers for the newby, I knew it was there somewhere.
Surely both statements are at odd with each other then.
Dean
I don't care how VS try to wrap this up and spin it into something positive - they're taking the Freedom menu away and replacing it with "eat in the Clubhouse or eat on the plane, off a tray, when we tell you". How far from 'Freedom' can you get? Not justifiable at J class prices...
This is very bad. VS can wave goodbye to much of my travel if they do bring this in. There are plenty of other airlines, and even one with comparable beds.
Much as I like flying VS, particularly in terms of (usually) great crews and an excellent seat/bed, I am not prepared to put up with poor food and a crummy meal service. If it is brought in on a non-optional basis I'll be on SAA for JNB, NZ for LAX and CX for HKG.
And if the UC food doesn't improve I'll be on AA/BA for the daytime flights too... [:(!]
BC
Much as I like flying VS, particularly in terms of (usually) great crews and an excellent seat/bed, I am not prepared to put up with poor food and a crummy meal service. If it is brought in on a non-optional basis I'll be on SAA for JNB, NZ for LAX and CX for HKG.
And if the UC food doesn't improve I'll be on AA/BA for the daytime flights too... [:(!]
BC
We still provide you with a meal its just the same only served at the same time
Don't think 1 tray served and cleared away within an hour of rotation is the standard we expect for the price paid(for this service I generally book and pay for a Y ticket).
Shame on VS management,I appreciate you staffers will get all the flack and theres not a lot you can do about it.
My mate who worked for BA (CSD) at the time of their launch of sleeper service (approx 4/5years ago) in CW said it was the biggest headache he had in 35 years of continual service with BA,and the moans of PAX were still there when he retired last year.
This reply from Virgin may amuse you:
Dear Stephen
Thank you for your email.
I have been liasing with our marketing department who have advised that we have not published this yet and so any information that your may have read from other websites may have been misrepresented and a new statement will be published on their websites stating the following:
- There will still be plenty of choice of full meals on board, as well as increased choices in the Clubhouses. The main difference is that the service flows have been restructured and meals will be delivered in "one hit" on a tray, in order to allow passengers who want to maximise their sleep to get their heads down earlier, as we were noticing that the traditional Freedom service was taking just too long on night flights. Passengers can still eat whenever they like during the flight.
- Breakfast will be served at passengers' seats (not just at the bar as is being suggested).
- Snooze Zone will stay for as long as there is a demand for it.
I hope I have been able to clarify the new Good Night flight service to you.
Kind regards,
XXXXXXX
Contact Centre Customer Services Team
Has the news been published on the Virgin site (it's down at the moment)? I specifically asked about LAX so the comment about choice in a club house is completely irrelevant. And it seems this applies to the whole cabin but snooze zone is still separate ... am confused!
So no to choice then, just lump cheapo supper on a tray[:0]
Dear Stephen
Thank you for your email.
I have been liasing with our marketing department who have advised that we have not published this yet and so any information that your may have read from other websites may have been misrepresented and a new statement will be published on their websites stating the following:
- There will still be plenty of choice of full meals on board, as well as increased choices in the Clubhouses. The main difference is that the service flows have been restructured and meals will be delivered in "one hit" on a tray, in order to allow passengers who want to maximise their sleep to get their heads down earlier, as we were noticing that the traditional Freedom service was taking just too long on night flights. Passengers can still eat whenever they like during the flight.
- Breakfast will be served at passengers' seats (not just at the bar as is being suggested).
- Snooze Zone will stay for as long as there is a demand for it.
I hope I have been able to clarify the new Good Night flight service to you.
Kind regards,
XXXXXXX
Contact Centre Customer Services Team
Has the news been published on the Virgin site (it's down at the moment)? I specifically asked about LAX so the comment about choice in a club house is completely irrelevant. And it seems this applies to the whole cabin but snooze zone is still separate ... am confused!
So no to choice then, just lump cheapo supper on a tray[:0]
There's a plane at JFK, to fly you back from far away
all those dark and frantic transatlantic miles
all those dark and frantic transatlantic miles
Hi "Virgin is the best"
Thanks for your reassuring info about travelling with the chapster. I'll just have to bring a miner's lamp in case I'm eating in the dark!:D
E
PS I think we got away without BlackCat noticing the infant in Upper.
Thanks for your reassuring info about travelling with the chapster. I'll just have to bring a miner's lamp in case I'm eating in the dark!:D
E
PS I think we got away without BlackCat noticing the infant in Upper.
Well I think our group reaction to GNF[:(!][n] on here has rattled someone's cage.I don't think the advance information
is a misrepresention and seems to be bang on target.
Maybe that should read cold Breakfast.
What about those of us who do not want to get our heads down and sit in the dark.
is a misrepresention and seems to be bang on target.
Breakfast will be served at passengers' seats (not just at the bar as is being suggested).
Maybe that should read cold Breakfast.
in order to allow passengers who want to maximise their sleep to get their heads down earlier
What about those of us who do not want to get our heads down and sit in the dark.
If you want to persecute, flame or direct anger at anyone, direct it at me, as I was among the people who suggested to VS that an option of a lighter/faster J meal service on some night flights would be a good idea.
This was after a MIA-LHR flight where there was no snooze zone, and no Clubhouse, but due to tailwinds, an fairly fast crossing (about 7h30). I had to be in a meeting first thing in the morning, so it was important that I got some rest during the night.
On this flight, the Freedom meal service was not completed until approximately 3 hours after wheels up, despite both myself and others around me trying to get a quicker service by asking for things to be delivered together, or ordering "snack and snooze" things.
I know at least one person on that flight gave up trying to get her snack-and-snooze, put her table away, and decided sleep was more important - yet from what I could see, they weren't complaining they were short changed on service, when they so obviously were, as there was no Clubhouse to offer pre-flight dining, they did want something to eat, and the crew were unable to deliver a snack-and-snooze item in a reasonable amount of time.
On this flight, the lights were also on full-belt during the service, and the FSM seemed loathed to dim the lights until the service was finished, despite the J lighting system being quite flexible.
So, seeing as I brought this to VS attention, I'm guessing that I was one of the people who catalysed this, so rotten eggs this way please.
However, save some for VS, for the wobbly execution, i.e. they extended it to the whole cabin, and mis-fired on the selection of flights (should have definitely gone for this as a snooze-like option on BOS, MIA and LAX).
Cheers,
Mike
This was after a MIA-LHR flight where there was no snooze zone, and no Clubhouse, but due to tailwinds, an fairly fast crossing (about 7h30). I had to be in a meeting first thing in the morning, so it was important that I got some rest during the night.
On this flight, the Freedom meal service was not completed until approximately 3 hours after wheels up, despite both myself and others around me trying to get a quicker service by asking for things to be delivered together, or ordering "snack and snooze" things.
I know at least one person on that flight gave up trying to get her snack-and-snooze, put her table away, and decided sleep was more important - yet from what I could see, they weren't complaining they were short changed on service, when they so obviously were, as there was no Clubhouse to offer pre-flight dining, they did want something to eat, and the crew were unable to deliver a snack-and-snooze item in a reasonable amount of time.
On this flight, the lights were also on full-belt during the service, and the FSM seemed loathed to dim the lights until the service was finished, despite the J lighting system being quite flexible.
So, seeing as I brought this to VS attention, I'm guessing that I was one of the people who catalysed this, so rotten eggs this way please.
However, save some for VS, for the wobbly execution, i.e. they extended it to the whole cabin, and mis-fired on the selection of flights (should have definitely gone for this as a snooze-like option on BOS, MIA and LAX).
Cheers,
Mike
Originally posted by jaguarpig
What about those of us who do not want to get our heads down and sit in the dark.
Reading lamps?
Mike
Mike,
I don't think anyone disagrees with the concept, as long as it an option within the J offering. The snooze zone was a great idea and it sounds as if GNF could further enhance this for customers who are looking to sleep.
As you say the mistakes seem to be in making it compulsory & very poor communication internally and externally.
Vslf
I don't think anyone disagrees with the concept, as long as it an option within the J offering. The snooze zone was a great idea and it sounds as if GNF could further enhance this for customers who are looking to sleep.
As you say the mistakes seem to be in making it compulsory & very poor communication internally and externally.
Vslf
Jst reminded myself that the news is announced on the Virgin Web site, so the response from the customer team is a little wrong - and the perhaps soft bricks aimed in the direction of VFlyer misplaced 
Glad Mike you are happy, I would be too with the option to choose when knackered or something else when not. Love the comment about reading lights
Glad Mike you are happy, I would be too with the option to choose when knackered or something else when not. Love the comment about reading lights
There's a plane at JFK, to fly you back from far away
all those dark and frantic transatlantic miles
all those dark and frantic transatlantic miles
Originally posted by Decker
This does create an interesting conundrum. Say I chose to sit at the bar and chat with colleagues. Could the crew ask me to whisper? Could I refuse? Does the "comply with crew requests" include lectures on manners?
We could ask you to keep the noise down yes if this was refused then the seat belt sign would go on if customers then refused to sit down we could use other options
Seems to me the best option is a completely seperate Snooze J cabin, with the bar area in another. probly not work on a 747 but would not be too difficult to set up on the longer planes, people would be able to specify a preference upon booking their ticket.
In my experience the cabins on all sections are on a go slow b quiet
routine anyway eastbound.
In my experience the cabins on all sections are on a go slow b quiet
routine anyway eastbound.
Glad (genuinely!) that you're happy Mike - I won't point the finger as everyone is entitled to an opinion - I think VS should have listened to a wider spread / different types of passenger before launching (mor maybe they still will?)
Like you, my main contention here has always been for the VS24, HKG and JNB flights.
A nice 12 hour flight for me would be:
Hour : Activity
1-2 : Eat & Movie
3-4 : Drink & Movie
5-10 : Sleep
11-12: Breakfast & tv
(With a trip to the bar & massage squeezed in!)
Thats a good 6 hours sleep, which is all I need in my own bed at home! The GNF service is tryng to put forward a service where some people can get up to 11 hours sleep ([:0]) on these LAX/JNB/HKG flights - who could possibly need that much?
After a tiring weekend in New York, the new service could come in handy, if very knackered, or like you say for biz users who need the sleep.
But for those people who have paid J class bucks, should at least have the option of J class service.
If this is not a cost saving exercise, then surely there is not a problem in VS having this as an option, and giving those people who want sleep a darkened, quieter area to get all the sleep they want.
Rich.
Like you, my main contention here has always been for the VS24, HKG and JNB flights.
A nice 12 hour flight for me would be:
Hour : Activity
1-2 : Eat & Movie
3-4 : Drink & Movie
5-10 : Sleep
11-12: Breakfast & tv
(With a trip to the bar & massage squeezed in!)
Thats a good 6 hours sleep, which is all I need in my own bed at home! The GNF service is tryng to put forward a service where some people can get up to 11 hours sleep ([:0]) on these LAX/JNB/HKG flights - who could possibly need that much?
After a tiring weekend in New York, the new service could come in handy, if very knackered, or like you say for biz users who need the sleep.
But for those people who have paid J class bucks, should at least have the option of J class service.
If this is not a cost saving exercise, then surely there is not a problem in VS having this as an option, and giving those people who want sleep a darkened, quieter area to get all the sleep they want.
Rich.
Originally posted by Richard28
Glad (genuinely!) that you're happy Mike
I'm happy that they are considering doing this, but I'm sad that there isn't going to be a choice offered, and even more saddened that they seem to be doing on some of the "wrong" flights.
Given what VITB said, VS already have a good pointer of how many full meals are served - around 20% tops of the J cabin on a shortish late night departure will take a full meal. We also know that around 20% choose to snooze pretty much straight away. We also know that op-ups will usually choose to eat because they didn't get Clubhouse access.
If there are so few people eating full meals, and they don't mind eating with the lights down low (like in the blue/purple light mode), giving a choice of a rapid service or the "works" would probably work okay - as long as an area of the aircraft remains reserved for people who do want a "snooze" service - and a full menu won't be served to those rows, only the supper trays.
Cheers,
Mike
Not trying to cause trouble here, just wanting to clarify something in a reply to a message by Decker.
I suspect that Decker might have been slightly tongue in cheek, but the post merely said "chat" to a colleague at the bar (ie not raucous riotous behaviour). Bearing in mind that people will not particularly have asked to be in a snooze zone, they might think it perfectly reasonable to sit and chat at the bar. Will the GNS really mean that everyone will be expected to be hushed the whole way over? Or what if your colleague sits on the ottoman at your seat (where I think there is a seat belt). How would this be handled?
Just curious.
E
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Decker
This does create an interesting conundrum. Say I chose to sit at the bar and chat with colleagues. Could the crew ask me to whisper? Could I refuse? Does the "comply with crew requests" include lectures on manners?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
We could ask you to keep the noise down yes if this was refused then the seat belt sign would go on if customers then refused to sit down we could use other options
I suspect that Decker might have been slightly tongue in cheek, but the post merely said "chat" to a colleague at the bar (ie not raucous riotous behaviour). Bearing in mind that people will not particularly have asked to be in a snooze zone, they might think it perfectly reasonable to sit and chat at the bar. Will the GNS really mean that everyone will be expected to be hushed the whole way over? Or what if your colleague sits on the ottoman at your seat (where I think there is a seat belt). How would this be handled?
Just curious.
E
Originally posted by jamie
How confusing. Premier team have just told me that there will still be a snooze zone implying you can opt not to have the GNS. I think they may be wrong..
When I phoned this morning I got the same response, I had a feeling they wouldn't know much about it but I thaught it was worth a try.
This really has turned into a right cock up! And one that has probably already lost VS paying J pax.
Right, lets take this back a second, back to the 14 / 15th of August. Around then, but I think a day or so before, Virgin announced on their website that they would be launching a new Good Night, Sleep Tight service. And that it was to allow J pax to get to sleep nice and quick on flights leaving after 9pm.
And now here we are on the 20th August and Virgin still are not able to provide a definitive answer on what this service is. We have Premier Team telling us that the Freedom service is still available and that the GNS is optional - an extension of the Snooze zone. And yet we have crew here who say it isn't and that it is compulsory.
I'm sorry, for a company Virgins size and visibility to announce a service that starts in threee weeks time and then five days later still not be able to offer a definative answer onto what that service does or doesn't include and whether or not it is compulsory is both shocking and an appauling level of service. They know that this debate is raging on and that it hasn't, overall, been a welcome announcement and yet they still haven't told us what is going on.
If we forget what is and isn't included in the service and whether or not it is compulsory I still have one major concern, Decker touched on it earlier. How is it going to work?
Dean and I will be in our Seats quite chatty and excited, enjoying our drinks, the flight, talking about the holiday we have planned. Realising we can't do one of the things we'd planned - and that was to eat together in one suite as you can't fit two trays on one table. While either side of us there are some business flyers who have just come straight from a long day of meetings and all they want to do is get straight off to sleep. Well i'm sure they will appreciate Dean and I next to them, and maybe me laughing away at some of the programs on V:Port.
Surely this is going to cause a lot of problems. If they insist on "offering" me this reduced service wouldn't it be better to try and find out what people want to do before they board / select seats so that those who want to sleep are all together and those who don't are all together and don't feel we are upsetting others by trying to enjoy the experience.
Foz xxx
Right, lets take this back a second, back to the 14 / 15th of August. Around then, but I think a day or so before, Virgin announced on their website that they would be launching a new Good Night, Sleep Tight service. And that it was to allow J pax to get to sleep nice and quick on flights leaving after 9pm.
And now here we are on the 20th August and Virgin still are not able to provide a definitive answer on what this service is. We have Premier Team telling us that the Freedom service is still available and that the GNS is optional - an extension of the Snooze zone. And yet we have crew here who say it isn't and that it is compulsory.
I'm sorry, for a company Virgins size and visibility to announce a service that starts in threee weeks time and then five days later still not be able to offer a definative answer onto what that service does or doesn't include and whether or not it is compulsory is both shocking and an appauling level of service. They know that this debate is raging on and that it hasn't, overall, been a welcome announcement and yet they still haven't told us what is going on.
If we forget what is and isn't included in the service and whether or not it is compulsory I still have one major concern, Decker touched on it earlier. How is it going to work?
Dean and I will be in our Seats quite chatty and excited, enjoying our drinks, the flight, talking about the holiday we have planned. Realising we can't do one of the things we'd planned - and that was to eat together in one suite as you can't fit two trays on one table. While either side of us there are some business flyers who have just come straight from a long day of meetings and all they want to do is get straight off to sleep. Well i'm sure they will appreciate Dean and I next to them, and maybe me laughing away at some of the programs on V:Port.
Surely this is going to cause a lot of problems. If they insist on "offering" me this reduced service wouldn't it be better to try and find out what people want to do before they board / select seats so that those who want to sleep are all together and those who don't are all together and don't feel we are upsetting others by trying to enjoy the experience.
Foz xxx
Originally posted by sean modiOriginally posted by jamie
How confusing. Premier team have just told me that there will still be a snooze zone implying you can opt not to have the GNS. I think they may be wrong..
When I phoned this morning I got the same response, I had a feeling they wouldn't know much about it but I thaught it was worth a try.
Yes indeed, see my earlier email from Virgin which was also confusing. On the one hand no choice but the Good Night Fright then on the other there's still a snooze zone. Think Virgin are a little rattled and confused.
I've asked to be moved to VS008 from VS024 from LAX - simply want to have the full experience on the next occasion. Will let you know the response.
There's a plane at JFK, to fly you back from far away
all those dark and frantic transatlantic miles
all those dark and frantic transatlantic miles
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